MINERVA - read-only archives


Infiltrate. Reveal. Destroy. This forum is gone, but not forgotten.
It is currently Sat Sep 21, 2019 5:43 pm

All times are UTC





Forum locked This topic is locked, you cannot edit posts or make further replies.  [ 45 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1, 2, 3
Author Message
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Oct 09, 2007 2:57 am 
Offline
Seeker
 Profile

Joined: Tue Oct 02, 2007 8:28 pm
Posts: 69
Location: Ithaca, NY, USA
Obviously much of my lengthy theory above relies on what I said about the 2 holographic images being mirror images of each other, so here they are, the lower one I've flipped horizontally as you can see. Clearly they're not identical, but maybe a slightly different perspective on the same thing. (though of course it's possible they're just taken from the middle of a symmetric hallway or something like that.) Why else though would these seemingly uninteresting images be up on the wall?

both
Image

upper
Image

lower one flipped horizontally, click for fullsize for better comparison
Image


Top
 

 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Oct 09, 2007 11:47 am 
Offline
Petitioner
 Profile

Joined: Fri Oct 05, 2007 7:06 am
Posts: 8
Quote:
Found yourself staring into an abyss, with the suspicion that it's
naught but a mirror?

.. without your mirrored shield, winged sandals or
invisible cloak, you're just a dumb, processed grunt with your
larynx torn out.


Though admittedly they don't immediately seem relevant. But something in my head is screaming parity violation!


I agree it's indicative of a parity violation but the second quite is also a reference to Perseus (who used his mirrored shield to fight Medusa without looking directly at her).

It's also a reference to the players previous life as a Combine soldier (processed and stripped of non-combat essential organs) and his apparent inability to defeat the stories Medusa without their sacred artifacts (guns and ammo).

The next chapter is called Chronoclasm? I'm not classically educated but I know it tranlsates roughly as "Destruction of time". That's also supportive of a "future Earth" scenario or at least indicative of time travel or a disruption of times sequential progression in some respects.


Top
 

 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Oct 09, 2007 9:26 pm 
Offline
Seeker
 Profile

Joined: Tue Oct 02, 2007 8:28 pm
Posts: 69
Location: Ithaca, NY, USA
Yeah there's various ways to interpret much of this. What seems the most interesting to me is that final quote from Someplace Else ("Half the universe, inaccessible to all but the highest energies") which seems like a perfect description of a mirror universe, which is actually a semi-legitimate physical theory. (especially in light of the other, less convincing evidence that's what he means. And I'm sure we can still cram time travel or something in there somewhere.) (oh, and apparently chronoclasm is now called "Out of Time")

While I'm at it, I read the review on rock, paper, shotgun! and Adam left a comment there where he said

Quote:
..there’s always my own Someplace Else for the original Half-Life. Technically, MINERVA is an indirect sequel, and any architectural similarities are more than deliberate… ;-)

Architectural similarities? That immediately made me think of the portal in Depth Charge

Image

and the gravity nullifier in SE. (better angle on the SE page: http://www.hylobatidae.org/minerva/para ... -else.html

Image

Obviously they're virtually identical, is this what he means? If so, Someplace Else is "An ancient machine tainted with human technology" then perhaps the portal in Depth Charge is an ancient machine? Could explain why this portal is where it is, not in a citadel. Hmm, an ancient portal unearthed in the Earths crust, where have I heard this recently?


Top
 

 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Oct 12, 2007 6:44 pm 
Offline
Petitioner
 Profile

Joined: Thu Oct 04, 2007 4:24 pm
Posts: 5
Mercer wrote:
Zebes was a base of the Space Pirates in the Metroid series (you know, Samus Aran and all that?)


Not just. Zebes was also Samus' second home, where the Chozo raised her before most of them sublimed and Zebes was left abandoned for the Space Pirates to use as a base. That's precisely why the Federation sends her to stop the Space Pirates' metroid experimentations on that planet, and why Zebes has Chozo relics scattered about through it.

I don't think I need to outline the similar parts of Minerva's life (at least in Terrapin's posthuman AI theory), but just in case: Samus/Minerva is orphaned (either literally or metaphorically) and adopted by the Chozo/Forerunners, taken to their planet of Zebes/Portalplace to be raised and taught to use their some of their artefacts. She then moves on to do stuff, and the Space Pirates/Combine come along and use Zebes/Portalplace as a base (admittedly, the Combine've just started exploring Portalplace). Yeah, it's a sketchy parallel, but it was my attempt at sounding cryptic and witty. ;)

Ace wrote:
Half the universe? Highest energies? Well I'm sorry, but that's just dead-nuts on.


Damn you and your plausible theories, Ace.


Top
 

 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Oct 14, 2007 4:29 am 
Offline
Acolyte
User avatar
 WWW  Profile

Joined: Tue Oct 02, 2007 6:20 am
Posts: 12
Location: Tomorrow
Screenshot from Someplace Else:
Image

_________________
-Anything that happens, happens
-Anything that, in happening, causes something else to happen, causes something else to happen
-Anything that, in happening, causes itself to happen again, causes itself to happen again; though not always chronologically


Top
 

 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Oct 15, 2007 5:49 am 
Offline
Acolyte
 Profile

Joined: Thu Oct 04, 2007 2:00 am
Posts: 14
Ansob. wrote:
Mercer wrote:
Zebes was a base of the Space Pirates in the Metroid series (you know, Samus Aran and all that?)


Not just. Zebes was also Samus' second home, where the Chozo raised her before most of them sublimed and Zebes was left abandoned for the Space Pirates to use as a base. That's precisely why the Federation sends her to stop the Space Pirates' metroid experimentations on that planet, and why Zebes has Chozo relics scattered about through it.


Ooooh, huh...That explains where all the Chozo stuff was doing lying around everywhere :roll:

I really need to get my backstory straight :)


Top
 

 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Oct 18, 2007 2:54 am 
Offline
Seeker
 Profile

Joined: Tue Oct 02, 2007 8:28 pm
Posts: 69
Location: Ithaca, NY, USA
Inspired by White Raven's comment on the blog I finally managed to noclip to the world through the portal in Metastasis (turn on noclipping and God mode and go straight down from the portal chamber) and yeah it's a lot clearer from there rather than trying to see it through the portal. As has been stated before, the architecture does look a lot like Someplace Else. The truss structure looks just like the hallways, and also what I hadn't noticed before was the spire-like things sticking out are also just like the ones in SE.

Image
Image

Seems Adam added these since he made that lux-aeterna page, maybe he wanted to make the hint clearer? This again makes me think of what Adam said, which I quoted a couple comments up about how "architectural similarities are more than deliberate." This implies to me that the "ancient machine" in SE was built by the same civilization that we seem to be seeing the ruins of through the portal. (Not to mention the bit about "eschatological secrets" implying whatever civilization was there is now done for.) So then this ancient civilization seems to be a good candidate for what Adam's referring to in these:
Quote:
...your ancients were superstitious, deluded zealots, ... My adopted forefathers are different, their scattered, discarded playthings more conducive to a meaningful imposition of my thoughts upon our captors.

We are alone in this battle, so should we dare to take up their ancient, abandoned weapons and become like gods ourselves?

And then there's the comparison I made above between the portal in Metastasis and the gravity nullifier in SE. The portal goes to this world of this ancient civilization, and has the same architecture that this civilization used, so this to me further suggests that they built it, and the Combine simply discovered it there. (Explaining why it is where it is, not in a citadel, and why they'd need this unusual power downlink from a satellite to power it.) (note SE predates Halo 2 and 3 so this idea wouldn't have seemed too derivative.)

Unfortunately I'm having a hard time bringing even just my various theories together into one cohesive story. That world could be a future or mirror Earth, making the civilization human. It certainly seems Minerva was human at some point, but she does seem to distinguish between her world and ours several times. She does say the world through the portal was her home once, maybe, but what exactly does that mean? I still think though that the Combine invaded her world, whatever that is.


Top
 

 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sat Oct 20, 2007 5:18 am 
Offline
Inductee
 Profile

Joined: Sat Oct 20, 2007 5:07 am
Posts: 2
L1ddl3monkey wrote:
The next chapter is called Chronoclasm? I'm not classically educated but I know it tranlsates roughly as "Destruction of time". That's also supportive of a "future Earth" scenario or at least indicative of time travel or a disruption of times sequential progression in some respects.

Mmm... Not quite. Let's look at dictionary.com:

dictionary.com wrote:
cat·a·clysm
–noun
1. any violent upheaval, esp. one of a social or political nature.
2. Physical Geography. a sudden and violent physical action producing changes in the earth's surface.
3. an extensive flood; deluge.


So while it is by necessity violent, it is not necessarily destructive, especially when applying it to such an abstract noun as time. Indeed, if we want to look further, towards the Greek (hah) origins of the word:

Online Etymology Dictionary wrote:
1633, from Fr. cataclysme, from L. cataclysmos, from Gk. kataklysmos, from kata "down" + klyzein "to wash."


So if we were to interpret it literally, it would translate to a "washing of time", a wiping clean.

Which to me, is infinitely scarier than a mere apocalypse.


Top
 

 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Oct 22, 2007 9:28 am 
Offline
Petitioner
 Profile

Joined: Mon Oct 22, 2007 8:06 am
Posts: 8
The Combine never controlled that world beyond the portal. I think Minerva said that. I remember hearing it somewhere. But they also knew what it'd look like before they got there, because there's a pretty holo-globe that depicts the landscape. Yet, there were drop ships and advisor pods, you have to look carefully on one of the monitors, coming out of the portal. They must have been looking for something that wasn't on the scarred surface, or they wouldn't have had a reason to visit it.

I mean, except for playing with antlions.


Top
 

 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Oct 22, 2007 11:59 am 
Offline
Petitioner
 Profile

Joined: Fri Oct 05, 2007 7:06 am
Posts: 8
Zetetic Elench wrote:

So if we were to interpret it literally, it would translate to a "washing of time", a wiping clean.



Hate to argue over ancient Greek, but I'm afraid you're wrong (and I'm right - nah nah nah and other suitably childish phrases :D ). I looked into this a bit further and you've made the mistake of thinking that the root word is Cataclysm. It isn't related and a "clysm" has a different meaning to a "clasm".

Chrono means time and clasm turns up the following:

clast-, clas-, -clastic, -clast, -clase, -clasia, -clasis, -clasis, -clasmic, -clasm
(Greek: break, break in pieces; broken, broken in pieces, crush)

Looked up here:

http://wordinfo.info/

So it does mean a breaking or crushing of time, which is close(ish) to what I originally thought. Kind of a moot point since Adam changed the name anyway.


Top
 

 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Oct 22, 2007 2:00 pm 
Offline
Horseman of the Apocalypse
User avatar
 WWW  Profile

Joined: Wed Jun 21, 2006 7:46 pm
Posts: 251
Location: Warsaw
L1ddl3monkey wrote:
So it does mean a breaking or crushing of time, which is close(ish) to what I originally thought. Kind of a moot point since Adam changed the name anyway.


<silliness>
Time Shock!
</silliness>


Top
 

 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Oct 23, 2007 4:55 pm 
Offline
Acolyte
User avatar
 Profile

Joined: Sat Feb 10, 2007 6:49 am
Posts: 113
Oh gods, I can only imagine what a time-travel themed Bio/System Shock game would be like ...


Top
 

 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Oct 25, 2007 3:05 am 
Offline
Acolyte
User avatar
 WWW  Profile

Joined: Tue Oct 02, 2007 6:20 am
Posts: 12
Location: Tomorrow
Imagine, if you will, that time were not major object.

You may well be the soldier mentioned in Someplace Else - the one that she grew reletively fond of and who almost found everything out.

_________________
-Anything that happens, happens
-Anything that, in happening, causes something else to happen, causes something else to happen
-Anything that, in happening, causes itself to happen again, causes itself to happen again; though not always chronologically


Top
 

 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Oct 25, 2007 4:49 am 
Offline
Seeker
 Profile

Joined: Tue Oct 02, 2007 8:28 pm
Posts: 69
Location: Ithaca, NY, USA
A couple things; L1ddl3monkey, Zetetic Elench, according to this a chronoclasm is a "paradox arising from interference in preceding historical events." (It's also the name of a short story by John Wyndham, which I think is part of the reason Adam changed the name.) Suggestive? Amazingly so I'd say, maybe that was also part of the decision?

scutter_2, I assume that quote you're referring to is this one
Quote:
You know, I once met someone who almost realised what was going on. A soldier, believe it or not. Way before your time.

Surprisingly, he seemed to understand. While the actual physics were beyond him (plus that awkward word 'classified' made book learning unlikely), his childlike curiosity quite endeared him to me.

It's a shame nobody learned from that incident.

Did you also get the "easter egg" in Someplace Else, or just read the titles.txt to get this one:
Quote:
Aren't you trying to get home? Such enthusiasm towards this world reminds me of someone. Remember that soldier, the bloodthirsty poet?

His predicament had to be recorded somewhere, even someplace away from prying eyes. Such an incident, the second of its kind, had to be remembered.

Second? You're the product of the third. Don't forget that.

Adam mentioned here that the second incident was an unreleased map pack for Opposing Force, and so I would think that's what he (she) was referring to.

But, in light of that first quote and this one from the recent RPS interview
Quote:
I’ve got the physics of my particular Half-Lifey universe all planned out

it suggests to me there is some sort of real or semi-plausible physical theory important to the plot. (I'd guess having to do with that portal or the world through it, or where Minerva has been to). Oh, for example perhaps a mirror universe? Or maybe something that could involve time travel. Dunno, just a thought.


Top
 

 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Nov 02, 2007 12:58 pm 
Offline
Acolyte
User avatar
 Profile

Joined: Fri Nov 02, 2007 12:41 pm
Posts: 16
Location: Italy
Quote:
The real aliens were closer than you ever thought - just around the corner, but out of reach, caught by a quirk of twentieth century physics. Half the universe, inaccessible to all but the highest energies.

But such a boundary could never remain unbreached.


So, if half the universe is inaccessible to all but the highest energies, we have access only to one half of our universe... that means we only live half life.

But what if some "highest energies" were able to breach such a "boundary"? A civilization with such power could rule both halves, or, if you prefer, could combine the two under its yoke.

Moreover, is there something between those two mirror universes? Something that is not any of the two, but just someplace else? Something we could call "border world"?

This speculation is intriguing...


Top
 

Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Forum locked This topic is locked, you cannot edit posts or make further replies.  [ 45 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1, 2, 3

All times are UTC



You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  
cron
Powered by phpBB © 2000, 2002, 2005, 2007 phpBB Group